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Key management issues

• Hurricane Zones (most of the caribbean is hurricane area, except the Colombian part between Cabo de la vela and Panama)

• No building on the Beach (building permanent buildings on the beach is not allowed)

• Jejenes (small bity beasts that can make living on the beach impossible)

• Water Supply (rain - tank ship)

• Material Supply

• Local Third Party interference Factors

• Local Business Opportunities and Alliances

I live in Colombia since 16 years, and i have built a wooden house with classical palm roof 18x9m foundation - 2 floors on stilts over concrete blocks at a in that time (1998) not developed beach in a mangrove/beach area in the San Bernardo Archipelago near Cartagena as there was only sand and water there i called it "ARENAQUA".

It started literally one day with comming in with a boat with a truckload of wood, a few sacks of cement, basic tools,  hire local workforce...so many of the experiences are directly applyable to a seasteading outpost as suggested in the Seasteading Outpost Belize Thread.

What concerns aquaculture and fishing potential in the caribbean i would like to have a closer look at Rafael Viera who built a spot where he runs a breeding program for Mero Guasa - but i suggest to split this theme into a "Aquaculture potential in the Caribbean" Thread.

What concerns your question if we could use the area of Arenaqua for an outpost this question unfortunatly has no simple yes or no as an answer - it depends on the project parameters.

If we decide on parameter hurricane we have basicly 3 options.

1) build a steastead outside the hurricane zones this would limit the possible sites to the Colombian coast between La Guajira and Panama.

2) build inside the hurricane zone - this would require hurricane proofe structures ( submerged would be great)

3) build a fast moving shipstead that can move out of the hurricane path which would be expensive. (lot of engine required)

Extremly touristic zones are bad due to high level of de facto regulation. Extreme remote zones are bad due to difficulty in galley and material supply. Access by land is a can have, access by boat is a must have. Building at the beach is forbidden everywhere in the caribbean - land 50 m behind the waterline is useless as a 50 m move for a fully grown seastead over land is impossible. This leaves a floating building site more or less as only realistic option. Floating also resolves the jejenes problem and a big part of the third party interference problem.

So the site must give some wave protection, friendly locals, good business alliances, not necessary a formal land title. A long term waterspace rent agreement with somebody who has a property that has absolutly no interrest in the waterspace would be great. What comes to mind is renting the waterspace in front of a extended cattle ranch. A remote ranch will be happy to leave the waterspace in front of the property to a seastead just for getting the benefit to have a fast boat in reach that can perform a medical evac of the ranch workers in case of  an accident. Ranches think in ton of cattle and hectar of grassland, beach and waterspace are of cero value for them.

What is in favor in Colombia is that the land that connects to the caribbean is bad land (arid, salt marsh, desert, red soil) so the ranches ouside the coastal urban centers (Santa Marta, Cartagena) are enourmous to hold a few head of cattle and are little productive. So a agreed long term anchor right in front of a ranch that includes some 15 kilometer beach (average) can be purchased for very little money.

 .

Typical cost imagine colombia - arid, bad land.

You can have the whole ranch 73 ha for 1000.0000.000 COP (500.000 USD)  - the floating right in front of the property  miles of ocean front  will go for much much less over the counter. (probably much less then the cost of a small car)

task split caribbean in zones...

So one of the first tasks when searching for a suitable outpost site would be to identify correctly ranch/beach situations on the map country by country all over the caribbean and diferentiate them from tourisms zones, real estate development zones, shipyard development zones, urban development zones and natural reseves which are all much less suitable for a beachfront waterspace seasteading venture.

Done this correctly you may start to send scouts in the most promising countries and zones to create lists of land owners contact numbers to approach.

Make sure that the scout is in company of a local - prefered a "primo" of the mayor of the nearest coastal settlement. - his family is "de facto handling" the zone - not the "authorities".

Then work the contacts digg up "special opportunities" like the ranch that has a lot of grass but little cattle (owner is not liquid to buy cattle), or the old ranchman with the wife who prefers to live in the city and the children living and working in spain.

For historica reasons (Colombia is the heir of the spanish overseas empire) Colombia owns most of the Caribbean watersurface. The blue area in the chart above is Colombian territorial waters. This fact and the status as emerging economic latin tiger nation, member of the CIVETS group, makes Colombia and especially the City of Cartagena with its hurricane free deepwater bay one of the "first places to look after" when talking about Seasteading and Baystead locations.

 I don't know Belize sufficiently to know where the ranch/beachfront zones are ubicated. Anybody here who has a deeper insight on Belize and can mark up the "promising zones".

Foto Belize

This part of Belize looks like a "high interference zone" zones that look "natural" can be protected parks, infested with jejenes - you need to go there scout, ask the locals to create a "info base" that allows you come to a informed decision. This can not be done by map and satelite, the neighborhood circumstances are the most important part of the business setup.

third party interference potential...

I have mentioned on other threads that in general if you do a float out project in the size of 20m diameter "third party interference" is a dominating project factor as well in project risk as in project cost.

It is therefore important that you make a preliminary analysis of what kind of potential third party interference factors and players do exist in a project location. I would recommend a biotop where the population density of potential interferers is low instead of a biotop where interferer occurance is high.

In a ranch zone the population of potential interferers is very low - the ranch owner and the maritime authority can interfer in theory but it is obvious that non of them has neither an interest nor a reason nor a practical means to interfer much.

In a industrial zone you are under the eyes of a lot of people that can (and very likley will) interfer . You have additional players like industrial neighbours that want to bring down your business, shipping lane interests, settlement plans, port authority, human rights, ambientalist groups, liquor authority, customes, mayor, etc... - the simple fact that you develop a activity in a "competed space" with many interests puts you in the center of all kind of fights, friction, and interference processes you have to take care of.

If we talk a scale of 1 to 10 in "interference freedom zones" being New York City Harbor with all its regulations a 1 and floating outside the economic exclusion zone of any state offshore on open ocean a 10.

On this scale a colombian ranchfront seastead would enjoy a high 9.5 of freedom to do whatever you want. while a colombian industrial zone seastead would enjoy a 7 - if situated in the middle of the bay of cartagena (1kilometer off shore) but only a 3 if situated near the shore of the same bay in the competed zone of manga.

At the end how much interference potential you have to deal with depends on your business plan.

Wil

concretesubmarine.com

how to spot and how to scout - then keep options open...

what i am proposing is just a method to find a spot where a activity like creating a seasteading outpost as suggested by Pastor Jason in the Seasteading Outpost Belize thread could be developed sucessfully.

I am proposing a method to find the spot - not a specific spot, not a property not a country. I try to explain how things work in Colombia where i live and which is the country that for historic reasons owns most of the caribbean sea and coastline out of the hurricane zone.

I propose that we asign seasteading viability zones on a scale 1-10 being 1 a zone where you can do nothing on the waterfront without getting entangled with several interference factors  and 10 a freedom zone where you have a de facto freedom compareable to EEZ but just off shore.

I postulate that caribbean ranch zones give a 9.5 of freedom for a seastead just a few meters off shore - and i argumented why that is so. (The interference freedom scale 1-10)

I agree that buying land and get involed in ranch business might be a too indirect approach - so i would suggest just to seek a symbiotic relation renting floating rights on a ranch seafront for the more fragile building phase until the stead is sturdy enough to float out to the more open water.

But the question if we stay in part land based like VENICE and ceate a seastead building facility to float out single family steads is also on the table - a geographic point like a seasteading mekka where all seasteading oriented activity is concentrated has its merit and could be "half land based" to enable the transition.

Most of all i suggest that we get funding as the reality is that all we plan to do needs budget frames - as i understand the discussion so far we could not make it to a 5000 USD/month budget frame ... so i think we are not even mounted to begin scouting for a place...

My experience is that if you build something in colombia in a 2 worker / some basic tools - a shadow roof - set up - that cranks out 1 ton of construction per day - a budget frame of 166 USD/day (5000/month) is kind of a minimum set up.

Imagine a start up like the image below - a couple of sparse connected floating concrete elements with people on it engaged in construcction of more floating elements aquaculture and similar activities. In a hurricane free bay in the caribbean in a 9.5 freedom zone on a > than 5000/month budget.

.

We do not need a exact business plan how big each concrete float element has to be and which purpose each boat serves. Some of the elements will later be part of the seastead - some sold to the industrial zone as floating docks...people will live in houseboats, in tents on the elements...camp on the beach...

make it touristic like quicksilver

make it industrial ship repair like the valliant jetti

make it aquaculture

Everything goes - just need to start to float out something.... on the long term it will develop along the following axes...

The catamaran float / The plate float out / The real estate squaremeter deal / The Captain Nemo float out / The bubble hotel / The current turbine / Breakwater lagoon marina / Oceanic port city design /

wil

-- Edited by admin on Friday 21st of February 2014 03:55:50 PM

road access in coral mangrove ambients...

mangrove / coral ambients have no road access - if they do it is the exception and there is always a major city built around the sea shore access point - and a cramped and competed city is not a good seasteading outpost location. I would see it as a more realistic setup to plan for a access road free ambient, in a tropical coastal zone. It matters little if the terrain is an island or part of the mainland coral mangrove ambients are ambients where the sea and the land have a mix up that goes over many miles and where roads and normal buildings can not be implemented.

This made cartagena the access point to the south american continent - the only point where ships could touch land and troops could desembark for  marching into the fertile and agriculture suitable interior on decent roads or waterways without being deminished in intransitable mangrove swamps jungles or deserts - between mexico and brazil -

this was 300 years ago in times of the spanish treasure fleet - and it has not changed that much what concerns shore access since.

To get a good image how buildings settlements and structures in mangrove / coral ambients look like and how they can be accessed by boat check here. To find a couple of videos about installations in coral/mangrove ambient in the san bernardo islands the rosario islands. They are already a kind of breakwater marina installation although they work on base of stilts and landfill instead of buoyant platforms.

  .  .

If the mangrove/coral ambient is part of an island  or part of the mainland makes as good as no difference -

Wil

concretesubmarine.com

santa cruz del islote - already seasteading...

One of the most interesting places might be 9.785882,-75.85903 santa cruz del islote - it is promoted by its inhabitants as the densest poblated spot on earth.  It is a coral rock that started as a fishing outpost for one family and as the family grew to a extended family they got "overpopulation" they live on fishing and tourism - and they would like to have a seastead as "extended territory" nearby - i think they have even a land title for that rock...

 .

They are really close to seasteading already... and they have birth and fishing rights to the lagoon of the san bernardo archipelago.

see video

They would be easy to convince that expanding islote by floating concrete honeycomb structures is a great idea. Watch the much bigger island in the background and the mainland coast being as good as uninhabitated.

demand in rincon...

<p>... there is need for development - industrial and touristic - so one business plan could be build floating platforms in that zone and sell them off as floating docks, and ship repair platforms for the bay of cartagena and its shipyard zone mammonal along the lines of (valliant yetti) - another would be a tourism platform along the lines of quicksilver for the coral zone of the san bernardo achipelago, another fishing platforms and aquaculture units for the people of islote,&nbsp; i was also thinking in floating bungalows for expanding the decamaron project, or in underwater rooms for tourism. Finally a big fancy floating international marina for yachts from all over the caribbean to pass trough the hurricane period outside the hurricane zone.</p>
<p>The good thing of this place is that it is at the moment where underdevelopment is still a leading factor, but the first fancy hotels and superyachts have already put their nose into the zone - so you can still have a big chunck of uncompeted beach for a seastead floating right - but you can already develop business when the seastead develops.</p>
<p>For a better idea of the zone check videos and images <a href="http://concretesubmarine.activeboard.com/t45887355/mero-guasa/">here</a></p>

right dose of remoteness / blend in nicely / use houseboats...

part 1

the relative remoteness is not a drawback i see it as a benefit as it gives you high score on the interference freedom scale. So without entering in a spot versus discussion i would insist in remote caribbean sites as first joice  - i would also insist in avoid tourism hot spots, industrial hot spots, so my ideal zone would be quite remote but  near ( 1- 2 hours in boat) to as well tourism hot zones and industrial hot zones to keep opportunities in both fields open.

part 2

In no way i would rule out houseboats - i just would say that a houseboat  accumulation of of the shelf housboats  - and nothing else - due to budget shortfall - is proving nothing so not really worth doing it.  Houseboat is fine to live in while building something that attracts investors because it goes beyond houseboats.

One of the most important factors to avoid interference is to blend into a zone - if you check the material i put here to give a realistic impression of the rincon zone - you will understand that of the shelf houseboats do not blend in very well.  It would be smarter to have platforms put traditional palmroof huts on them and live just as natives and tourist live in the zone already.  If you blend in the chances that you get interference are minimum.  Nobody will make a case against you because you replace traditional landfill and stilts (which have a eco impact) with much smarter and environment friendly floating bases.

A tipical settlement in the zone right now looks like that: - a concrete floating platform with a palm hut on it will just look NO DIFFERENT but avoid eco destroying landfills in coral areas.

 The people who built this are infringing atl least 3 laws - you can not build in a zone of 30 m of the waterline , you can not make any changes to the litoral (landfill) you can not cut a single mangrove bush.

The fact that those buildings are still there shows how bendable things are in colombia. Many people just think that this is nice after all - so it gets tolerated. If the houses would be ugly and full of a hippie community they would have got problems.

I could sell platforms to the (wealthy owners) of such existing settlements as it would allow to still live in the zone and have a de facto house there without building a fixed fundament in the beach zone, cut no mangrove bush, so still stay inside the existing law.

What you seek is the right mix of business opportuity, bendability, interference freedom, and tolerance culture, so that your project can prosper - a good advise is blend in do as the romans do - avoid to create a "strange appearance that triggers counter reactions".

Be part of a desireable development instead of being part of a style breach.

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-- Edited by admin on Saturday 17th of March 2012 06:42:04 PM

Floating Home Navegante Cholon in the San Bernardo Island Mangrove Zone Colombia

.  It is a floating housing space built at housing costs with housing materials glass doors, windows like you would use in a normal house - so its cost per squaremeter is compareable to normal housing.

It avoids the pitfalls of other housing projects in the San Bernardo Islands that have got fricction with the Authorities because they cut down mangroves to clear building lots, fill up coral areas to create building lots, or illegally build in the public 30m waterfront beach zone.

It is certainly not a yacht and seaworthy for ocean crossing - but this does not matter as the San Bernardo Zone is naturally protected from high waves and hurricane free all the year round.

Other than the Lozman home which was not mobile at all and doomed to destruction when standing in the way of real estate interests - the navegante Cholon could move a few kilometers away from such a dogfight hotspot and even make it to another country.

Its drawback is that it is made of steel and the maintainnce shedule of a steel structure in caribbean marine ambient is tremendously expensive.

For a wide (and seasikness free stable) structure like the Navegant Cholon going to drydock is particulary expensive as the beam makes it needing a BIG drydock that normally operates big ships at big budgets.

So they run on big ship budget manintenance shedules and cost frames.

Having built that on a maintenance free floating concrete base it would be just a perfect single family seastead in a ideal easy going tropic  low cost setup.

-- Edited by admin on Sunday 1st of April 2012 02:37:17 PM

So if we would have a reasonable budget for doing it today we would install in the san bernardo island area and start with a small concrete honeycomb ramform shape of not more than 15x 7 m - with a deck struture similar to navegate cholon - a open light concept - suitable for a tropic easy going hurricane free environment.

This structure would allow to live and work on the seastead itself - while keeping building it to larger size in the stern section as described in the ramform seastead thread.

Compare the seaworthyness of such a structure with KON TIKI and keep in mind that this raft made it over the pacific – you would get something technically at least equal. Just your “bambus hut” is a comfortable superstructure and your “balsa logs” are bigger and tougher and longer lasting as made of concrete. What we can learn from Kon Tiki is that it might be useful to maintain a certain flexibility between the floating elements, and that flat raft floats are much more seaworthy than generally expected.

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